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Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 12:59:31 -0800
To: list@contrabass.com
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: Bass Sax - Condensation
>Thanks! I reallly appreciate your input, Grant.
You're welcome, but it was actually Steve's input. :-)
My own input is that a water key might disturb the bore of the horn at a
rather sensitve place. Think how much bassoon players pay for a good
bocal. Bari, *I think*, is designed with this in mind (anyone know off
hand if they're careful where the water key is located?). On the other
hand, I believe there is a type of water key often used on brass
instruments that is considered to disturb the bore/air column to only a
minimal degree (Arundo? Armando? something like that...). It looks like a
small cylinder set perpindicular to the bore, and might be the "minimally
invasive" route if you're set on perforating the horn.Happy birthday!
Grant
>farfl's house wrote:
>
>> Edward,
>> Happy Birthday!
>> At one point I was thinking of adding a "bis" key to my 1924-5 Conn bass. I know
>> who owned the horn before I did, and judging from the recordings, I'd say that the
>> guy really "smoked" just using the other Bb fingerings available! So I'm making
>> do, and getting used to no bis key. However, a condensation key is another matter!
>> I can't imagine getting along without mine; when I originally was going to buy a
>> bass sax from the 'teens, Johnathan Steenstra was going to add a condensation key
>> to it.
>> I think that's a necessity, really, and wouldn't prompt listers to admonish; "Keep
>> It Original". That sort of outcry is usually reserved for cosmetic things, like
>> whether one should mess about with their sax's original finish or replating.
>> Sincerely,
>> Steven Lederman
>> Klezmer bass saxophonist and Sarrusophonist.
>>
>> Edward Branham wrote:
>> >Do any of the bass saxes have a condensation key like the bari saxes have? As
>> >profane as this statement may sound, I'm considering adding one to my silver
>> > 104k Buescher.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
------------------------To: list@contrabass.com
Cc: list@contrabass.com
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 17:04:56 -0800
Subject: Re: Bass Sax - Condensation
From: mgrogg@juno.com
>hand if they're careful where the water key is located?). On the
>other hand, I believe there is a type of water key often used on brass
>instruments that is considered to disturb the bore/air column to only
>a minimal degree (Arundo? Armando? something like that...). It looks
>like a small cylinder set perpindicular to the bore, and might be the
>"minimally invasive" route if you're set on perforating the horn.
They are Amado water keys. The cost on them is about $5.50 in brass, or
$6.50 in silver plate. That is from Ferree's.Installationwise, you need to be sure you have the key placed at the
lowest point on the tubing arch, so that it will drain properly. That
needs to be the lowest place in the position the horn will be in when you
drain water. Drill a hole, debur it. Tin the base of the water key, and
the intended spot on the horn. Flux and then sweat it on. Clean off all
the flux and assemble the little barrel plunger and the spring, and put
on the retainer clip. (it helps to have circlip pliers with the smallest
ends to play with the clip, it is small and can be ornery to install with
out the right tool.MG
------------------------
Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 17:26:08 -0500
From: Edward Branham <ebb@usa.net>
To: list@contrabass.com
Subject: Re: Bass Sax - CondensationThanks for the install instructions!
Do you use 60/40 solder (as in electronics) or silver solder (as in plunbing)
or does it not matter?Best Regards,
Edward Branham
mgrogg@juno.com wrote:
> >hand if they're careful where the water key is located?). On the
> >other hand, I believe there is a type of water key often used on brass
> >instruments that is considered to disturb the bore/air column to only
> >a minimal degree (Arundo? Armando? something like that...). It looks
> >like a small cylinder set perpindicular to the bore, and might be the
> >"minimally invasive" route if you're set on perforating the horn.
>
> They are Amado water keys. The cost on them is about $5.50 in brass, or
> $6.50 in silver plate. That is from Ferree's.
>
> Installationwise, you need to be sure you have the key placed at the
> lowest point on the tubing arch, so that it will drain properly. That
> needs to be the lowest place in the position the horn will be in when you
> drain water. Drill a hole, debur it. Tin the base of the water key, and
> the intended spot on the horn. Flux and then sweat it on. Clean off all
> the flux and assemble the little barrel plunger and the spring, and put
> on the retainer clip. (it helps to have circlip pliers with the smallest
> ends to play with the clip, it is small and can be ornery to install with
> out the right tool.
>
> MG------------------------
From: Jeff Howard <Jeff.Howard@superstar.com>
To: "'list@contrabass.com'" <list@contrabass.com>
Subject: Misc instruments for sale
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 15:46:31 -0600FYI - since I don't have any money to buy anything. :)
A couple of bass saxes, a helicon, an "F" Mezzo Sop, King Saxcello in Bb,
and other misc instruments. http://members.aol.com/welchsax/instruments.htmBy the way, I'm Jeff Howard. I play bari sax, but really want to pick up a
bass sax. Now if I can just come up with the money. Anyway, I working with
a few others to put together a swing/big band/jazz fusion band here in
Tulsa. They recently opened a "swing" club, but there's only one local
swing band. I think a bass sax would be a great addition, and nicely
unique, but I don't have the dough just yet. But I'm still scouring the net
checking out all that I find. Hence the link above. I read in the archives
from a few years back someone in Tulsa had a bass for sale, and if I
remember correctly, he's the one I purchased by bari through. Don't know if
there are any others around. Anyway, love the list.Jeff Howard
------------------------Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 17:45:53 -0800
To: tokamak@compumile.ndirect.co.uk
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: Subscribe to contrabass email list and say hello
Cc: list@contrabass.com
>Dear Mr. Green,
>
>There seems to be some problem using the web site to subscribe to the
>contrabass mailing list, so I have taken the liberty of addressing myself
>to you directly. Would you be kind enough to post however much of the
>note below you consider relevent, and add me to your list.You've now been added: welcome aboard! I subscribed you to the "digest"
form of the list (in which a day's worth of messages are concatenated into
one email message), however the "immediate" version (in which each post is
sent individually) is also available. The digest version seems to be
preferred by most, but the immediate version is more conversational, and
easier to reply generally. Let me know if you'd like to be switched to the
other format.>This is just a note to introduce myself, and thank you for putting up an
>interesting web site.Glad you've enjoyed it!
>I was very pleased to find your site. Others have told me of having found
>someone else who likes "all those weird instruments", but they had never
>noted the address. As of yet the cravings are not to severe, and I am
>reasonably satisfied with a bass clarinet (Normandie down to Eb), a
>contrabass clarinet (LeBlanc BBb paperclip down to D), a Great bass
>rackett (Early Music Shop), and a bass harmonica (Hohner), but I have been
>offered a Sousaphone, and a friend has reported seeing something in France
>that might have been a sarrusophone or an ophecliede. I suspect that I am
>beyond help - I have even been tempted by a very battered, but very large,
>tuba in my local music shop.Yes, sounds as if you have several of the symptoms ;-) Sarrusophones and
ophicleides are both fairly sought-after here, at least by us Afflicted.
It is generally worthwhile (and always appreciated) when one runs across
such instruments to pass any information along!>The bass and normal soprano clarinets get played regularly, and the
>contrabass will be, once a few more repairs have been done. The
>contrabass seems to be similar to the one you once had, meant to be
>dismantled for transport, but has been soldered together in such a way as
>to make removing some of the axles difficult. It was bought in a sad
>state, but has cleaned up well, and is attracting much attention in the
>repairers, where it languishes until I can afford to have the mis-soldered
>centre joint fixed. The plans include replating, but that will have to
>wait until a: I can sell my soprano sax to pay for it and b: the
>installation of a larger plating tank at the repairers.Yes, the old horns suffer more than their share of indignities.
>I play (very badly) in the local wind band, and the contrabass is awaited
>with interest. We are about to lose our euphonium player, and the
>conductor says that he has the euphonium parts in treble clef Bb.
>I am not sure whether I will produce the same pitch as the euphonium, or be
>an octave lower, in either case it should be fun. Are there any pitfalls
>to playing contrabass I shold be aware of? I have managed to obtain a
>mouthpiece and reeds from Vandoren - they seem to still be making them -
>but their local rep. said they were the first he had sold in five years.
>Information about playing these larger instruments seems to be scarce.Actually, your bass clarinet nicely covers the euphonium range, and would
play the correct octave when reading directly from euphonium TC Bb parts.
The contrabass plays an octave lower, well into the tuba register: your
lowest D will sound the lowest C on the piano keyboard, and octave+ lower
than the bass clef.Pitfalls? The old contras are somewhat prone to leaking pads, but can be
adjusted to play well. Old contra mouthpieces are sometimes found to be
too large for the reeds that are now available, but this can be solved by
ordering a modern mouthpiece directly from Leblanc (or Leblanc's subsidiary
"Woodwind"). You'll probably want to start with reeds that are softer than
the reeds you use on soprano and bass clarinet, perhaps a #2 Vandoren,
depending on your mouthpiece. Contras are also particularly sensitive to
mouth position on the mouthpiece: your lower lip should contact the reed at
the same point that the mouthpiece lay begins to diverge from the reed.
There is a narrow "sweet spot" at that position, at which you'll have the
best response from the horn.>Having dealt with the important items above, it remains to tell you that I
>am Kevin Highley, am round and bearded, and live in Bognor Regis, a
>smallish town on the south coast of England.
>
>
>Yours Kevin Highley.
>
>tokamak@compumile.ndirect.co.uk
>
Welcome to the list, Kevin!Grant
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
------------------------From: PaulC135@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 21:52:31 EST
To: list@contrabass.com
Subject: Re: Subscribe to contrabass email list and say helloIn a message dated 2/2/99 1:46:01 AM, gdgreen@contrabass.com writes:
<<
You've now been added: welcome aboard! I subscribed you to the "digest"
form of the list (in which a day's worth of messages are concatenated into
one email message), however the "immediate" version (in which each post is
sent individually) is also available. The digest version seems to be
preferred by most, but the immediate version is more conversational, and
easier to reply generally. Let me know if you'd like to be switched to the
other format. >>Hi Grant,
I did not know I still had this option. Could you switch me to the one-a-day
digest, and not the individual post. This will save much e-mail trauma daily.
Thanks.
Paul Cohen
------------------------To: list@contrabass.com
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 1999 21:22:33 -0500
Subject: 60/40 or fight?
X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 5-7
From: mgrogg@juno.com
I have been using the new lead free silver mix solder now for about a
year on my brass instrument work. You need to do a little better job of
cleaning the joint and fluxing than with the lead based solder, but you
don't have the hazards that come with lead. If you pre-tin both sides of
the joint, you will do a neater job with less chance of a sloppy looking
job.MG
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