Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2005 22:12:39 -0800
From: "Grant Green"
Subject: [CB] Horns FS!
Hi,
I made a deal with my wife: I sell off the brass instruments in
my collection, and she lets me buy a heckelphone. So, you get first
option :-)
- A Bb bass ophicleide (9 keys, I think), by the inventor Halary;
[NOTE: no longer for sale]
- An Eb bass tuba by H.N. White (silver colored, old but probably
not antique);
- A Bb bass trumpet (Getzen) in essentially brand new condition;
- An F contrabass trumpet made by Carl Kleinsteuber (sorry Carl!
I hate to sell this, but that was the bargain);
- A Bb marching baritone (I think of it as a bass flugelhorn);
- An F single horn (Holton);
- A King Eb alto sax; and
- An old Bb bass clarinet (student model - Bundy, I think, but
plays well).
The last two were classified as "extra".
I'll be out of town all next week, but if anyone is interested
in any of the above, just let me know. Anything left goes on eBay after
I return.
Enjoy!
Grant
================================
Grant Green Contrabass.com
Sarrusophones & contrabass winds
================================
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Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 10:34:40 -0600
From: "Gregg Bailey"
Subject: [CB] subcontrabass tuba/contrabass french horn!!
I just found a website mentioning a subcontrabass tuba in CCC
and a contrabass french horn! It regards the following:
The Third International Tuba Workshop-Symposium
June 14-17, 1978
The University of Southern California
Jim Self, Conference Host
The web address is:
Does anyone have more information about contrabass french
horns? I have wondered for some time why I hadn't heard about
lower-than-normal french horns. The french horn has such a
beautiful, round tone quality in its middle and upper registers, and
that tone quality would be so nice at a lower range!
-Gregg
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 10:43:35 -0600
From: "Gregg Bailey"
Subject: [CB] Why are non-transposing low brass said to be in Bb?
I realized the other day that I am terribly confused about one
aspect of transposing instruments versus non-transposing
instruments. I have understood for years the idea that a
transposing instrument sounds something OTHER than C when the note C is
on the page, whereas non-transposing instruments DO sound C when C is
on the page. So, even though the standard band tuba is based on a
Bb harmonic series, it still reads at concert pitch and is therefore
non-transposing. So, why is it referred to as a BBb tuba???
When it plays a written C, it sounds a C, not a Bb! I realize
that there has to be a distinction between tubas based on a Bb harmonic
series or C harmonic series, etc., but the nomenclature seems wrong.
-Gregg
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "Wik Bohdanowicz"
Subject: Re: [CB] Why are non-transposing low brass said to be
in Bb?
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:16:14 -0000
> When it plays a written C, it sounds a C,
> not a Bb! I realize that there has to be a
distinction between tubas
> based on a Bb harmonic series or C harmonic series, etc.,
but the
> nomenclature seems wrong.
Firstly it is a Bb tuba because the harmonic series is that of a
tube whose fundamental is Bb. (Bb, Bb, F, Bb etc). A C tuba
has a has a harmonic series based on C, and Eb instrument based on Eb
etc.
In the civilized orchestral world a Bb tuba part is written in
bass clef and what comes out is what is written. In the brass band
world all parts (except bass trombone) are written in the treble clef
and in a transposing pitch. Hence when a BBb bass tuba player sees
written middle C Bb below the bass clef comes out. Some players
realize this: many do not. I was at a UK Tuba conference in
Birmingham some years ago when Sam Pilafian was running a Jazz
class. He asked the (well respected) BBb bass player to
play a series of notes as a basis for the improvisation. What
came out was a tone lower and so he has to ask for the sequence again
but a tone higher. From what I have seen US tuba players seem to
know more about how their instruments work than those in the UK (Or
perhaps I've just met the more knowledgeable ones).
As An EEb bass player I'm lucky in that the physical
transpositions cancel each other out so the notes are in the same
place. I just add three flats to all treble clef parts.
Wik
---------------------------------------------------------
From: David Richoux <>
Subject: Re: [CB] bassoon blues
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 09:31:51 -0800
Hi all,
I was playing some records by the late Illinois Jacquet and
found an absolute wonderful version of "'round Midnight" he did on
Bassoon - pretty much a 6 minute solo. It can be found on the CD
re-issue of "The Blues: That's Me!" You can hear a sample on
Amazon.com and used copies of the CD are pretty cheap...
Dave Richoux
On Jan 4, 2005, at 5:09 PM, Jim Quist wrote:
>>> Can anyone point me to a recording of the blues
played on
>>> bassoon? Not sorta kinda the blues, but something
amazing.
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "Sung Hwang Wang"
Subject: [CB] Leblanc/Vito/Woodwind Contrabass Mouthpieces
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 10:29:48 -0800
Hello, a question for the contrabass clarinettists out there.
I understand all three brands are essentially made by Leblanc
for its lines of contra clarinets. Are there dimensional variations
that make them play differently?
I also know they all take Vandoren CB reeds.
I own 2 contra mouthpieces, one is a Woodwind I use on my BBb,
and the other is a Leblanc for my EEb. Is it worth it to buy a Vito
brand to try it out, or are they all the same and I shouldn't bother?
Appreciate any input.
Willy
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "mgrogg@juno.com"
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 18:34:53 GMT
Subject: Re: [CB] Why are non-transposing low brass said to be
in Bb?
BBb tubas are built on the BBb harmonic series. Eb tubas
on an Eb harmonic series, CC and F are like wise built on other
harmonic series. BBb for whatever reason became the defacto
standard for band music in the US, and are the tuba most commonly
encountered.
All of the read and play the notes at concert (sounding pitch)
and the player uses the proper fingering to achieve the proper
note. The one big exception to this rule is British Brass Band
music where all of the brass except the Trombone read treble clef music
that is transposed to have the proper sounding pitch from the written
note.
All of this information can cause tuba players to go around
mumbling to themselves, what with keeping 6 or 7 sets of fingerings in
mind, as well as perhaps fingerings for French/Freedom Horn and
trombone slide positions all straight. Add further confusion if
the trombone in question is a double independant rotor Bass.
Michael Grogg
Tuba and other Diverse instruments
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "mgrogg@juno.com"
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 18:41:53 GMT
Subject: Re: [CB] subcontrabass tuba/contrabass french horn!!
The ONLY contrabass Freedom Horn I have heard of was built for
Roger Bobo. He is reported to have recorded with that instrument,
although I have not knowingly heard any of the music. Since Roger
was playing in California in that time period, it would make sense that
it would make and appearance at an ITEC conference there.
MG
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 10:45:23 -0800
From: "Chuck Guzis"
Subject: Re: [CB] Why are non-transposing low brass said to be
in Bb?
>As An EEb bass player I'm lucky in that the physical
transpositions cancel
>each other out so the notes are in the same place. I
just add three flats
>to all treble clef parts.
Wik, what do you do when you get one of the bass parts that seem
to be customary in the Low Countries, wherein the tuba is written in
bass clef AND transposed?
I know--ask for a treble clef part! :)
I don't know of any other instruments where the basic pitch of
the instrument within the same family regularly demands that the player
learn a specific set of fingerings. So, as one who plays BBb CC
Eb and F tubas, I need to know 4 different sets of fingerings.
The only similar situation that comes to mind is that of
orchestral horn, where the old works were written for a natural horn in
a given pitch and the modern valved horn player is required to
transpose on the fly.
Cheers,
Chuck
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 12:58:36 -0600
From: "Gregg Bailey"
Subject: [CB] recorders: multiple sets of fingerings
Chuck,
The recorder family is such that you have to know one set of
fingerings for the C instruments (soprano and tenor, etc.) and another
set of fingerings for the F instruments (alto and bass, etc.).
Although the two sets of fingerings are identical, just a fifth or
fourth apart, I find myself having a hard time adapting to the F
recorders, since I am more familiar with the C recorder fingerings.
-Gregg
> I don't know of any other instruments where the basic pitch
of the
> instrument within the same family regularly demands that
the player
> learn a specific set of fingerings. So, as one who
plays BBb CC Eb and
> F tubas, I need to know 4 different sets of fingerings.
---------------------------------------------------------
From: "Gordon Hallgren"
Subject: Re: [CB] Leblanc/Vito/Woodwind Contrabass Mouthpieces
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 14:47:10 -0500
> I also know they all take Vandoren CB reeds.
If you only like even sizes (1, 2, 3, etc).
Unless you have only the very old Leblanc MP, they should take
other brands, and even possibly those intended for other instruments.
Try others to find out what works best for you.
> I own 2 contra mouthpieces, one is a Woodwind I use on my
BBb, and the
> other is a Leblanc for my EEb. Is it worth it to buy a Vito
brand to try
> it out, or are they all the same and I shouldn't bother?
Don't waste your money. If you think you want to try another MP,
go with something better like a Clark Fobes Debut, which is a nice MP
and a really good deal at $89!
gordon
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 14:26:53 -0600
From: Jim Quist
Subject: Re: [CB] bassoon blues
> I was playing some records by the late Illinois Jacquet and
found an
> absolute wonderful version of "'round Midnight" he did on
Bassoon -
> pretty much a 6 minute solo.
That's wonderful news. I did pick up a cassette (remember
those?) of The Message, with Bassoon Blues. I will follow up on this
recommendation, as well as the others. Thanks gang !
Jim
---------------------------------------------------------
From: Michael Grogg
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 21:00:38 GMT
Subject: Re: [CB] Why are non-transposing low brass said to be
in Bb?
Or those traditionalists of us who play the parts on natural
horn and bring a bag of crooks and extensions to make up the right
length horn. ;-)
Michael Grogg
>> don't know of any other
instruments where the basic pitch of the instrument
within the same family regularly
demands that the player learn a specific set of
fingerings. So, as one who
plays BBb CC Eb and F tubas, I need to know 4
different sets of fingerings.
The only similar situation that comes to mind is that of
orchestral horn, where the old works were written for a natural horn in
a given pitch and the modern valved horn player is required to
transpose on the fly.
Cheers,
Chuck
***End of Contrabass Digest***