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Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 18:50:26 -0500
From: John Howell <John.Howell@vt.edu>
Subject: Bass Saxes in Community Bands! & Helicon
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>From: RJ Carpenter <emerald1@megsinet.net>
>For some reason; the Blacksburg Community Band has a Bass Sax... See for
>yourself at http://www.bev.net/community/NRAC/perform/bbcb1995.html.
>(Center; back Row; right of tuba) I don't know; but that seems odd to me!:)
>TristanWell, you've already heard from Bob Thomas, our bass sax player, so all
I'll do is ask why it seems odd to you? I second everything Bob said about
the sound and use of the instrument. It's really a good sound to have.
(Of course when I write arrangements for the band, I always write him a
real bass sax part!)>From: LeliaLoban@aol.com
>There's a big brass bass instrument for sale at the Georgetown Flea Market in
>Washington, D. C. today (Sunday).
>I saw the dealer setting this horn out as I was leaving. She had it
>disassembled (bell off), on the asphalt, with some other stuff leaning on it,
>so I'm not sure whether this thing is a helicon or a sousaphone, and I wasn't
>able to find the serial number on it.A helicon (at least the ones I've seen and/or played) does not have a
removeable bell.John
John & Susie Howell
Virginia Tech Department of Music
Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A. 24061-0240
Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034
(mailto:John.Howell@vt.edu)
http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html
---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 15:50:39 -0700
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: Monster Instruments
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>I run the contrabassoon production at Fox. I must admit to thinking of a
>huge contrabassoon, permanently set up outside the factory, hooked up to an
>air compressor and serving as a noon whistle for the entire town of South
>Whitley. Of course at the low frequency (about 14-15hz) the sound would be
>felt more than heard and we'd probably be blamed for problems with the dairy
>cattle across the road! (I wonder if low frequency sound of sufficient
>amplitude can be used to disrupt tornadic weather.)
>
>Chip Owen
>Columbia City, Indiana
><mailto:cowen@whitleynet.org>Actually, the upper harmonics ought to still be audible: the timbre might
seem "string bass-like" (the octave harmonic is particularly strong on the
string bass). Perhaps with time, the surrounding population would begin to
perceive 14 Hz as a pitch, even grow to enjoy it ... and eventually all
become contrabassoon customers ;-)And if the cattle begin giving creme fraiche, call it "added value" ;-)
Grant
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 16:00:11 -0700
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: Bass Saxes in Community Bands!?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>A third alternative to playing bass sax and tuba parts would be to do what
>contrabass clarinet players do when they don't have a separate part -- play
>the bass clarinet part as written. The contrabass clarinet also puts a reed
>"edge" on the tuba sound and the horn is a heck of a lot easier to schlepp
>than a bass sax.This works particularly well on the contrabass clarinet, because the ranges
are written the same way. The problem with reading bass clarinet parts on
bass sax is that either (a) the part goes down to Eb or C, and you stop at
the Bb, or (b) you play it in the right octave (an octave higher than the
bass clarinet is written) and spend half the time in the altissimo. Bass
sax and contrabass clarinet parts are often scored on the same part because
they play the same octave as written (e.g., written middle C is the Bb
below the bass clef for both instruments).To read off the bass clarinet part well, you have to pay attention to when
the BCl is doubling the tubas, and when it is playing a middle voice (e.g.,
lower part of the clarinet choir in pseudo-string mode). A middle voice
transposed down an octave often muddies the sound, whereas a bass voice
doubled an octave down is reinforced - depending on the harmony. I often
mark my bass clarinet parts with up and down arrows to remind me where to
play as written, and where to take it up an octave (to play unison with the
BCls).Enjoy!
Grant
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 16:04:18 -0700
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: Bass Saxes in Community Bands!?<g>
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>While somebody mentioned that, I have a question. Why, on contrabass
>clarinet, do my eyes jiggle violently around 123 C#/C/B, but on notes below
>that, they stagnate? It seems like it should shake more AN OCTAVE LOWER! It
>does not. How come?On most instruments, most of the sound power comes from the fundamental
rather than the upper harmonics. The middle B/C/C# frequency must
correspond to your eye's resonant frequency (or that of your glasses...).
Objects that are not musical instruments, e.g., percussion ;-), often do
not resonate in octaves and consonant intervals. Just because your eye
resonates at one frequency doesn't mean that it will resonate at the octave.GGrraanntt
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
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---------------------------------------------------------From: RBobo123@aol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 19:57:41 EDT
Subject: Help with ranges
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comCan someone point me to a page that has Ranges for Instruments, it would help
me alot.
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 08:32:12 -0400
Subject: Re: Help with ranges
From: mgrogg@juno.com
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comGo ye forthe to thy local Library, or other assemblage of books, and look
forthe upon the stacks for the tome "Orchestration" by Walter Piston. I
would humbly suggest pages 3 to 354. The practical ranges of all the
modern and not so modern orchestral instruments are contained therein.If you can find the English translation of the orchestration book by
Dmitri Shostakovitch, ye shall be even more enlightened.MG
Yoda to Luke on table manners: Use the forks, Luke.
On Mon, 14 Jun 1999 19:57:41 EDT RBobo123@aol.com writes:
>Can someone point me to a page that has Ranges for Instruments, it
>would help
>me alot.___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 21:39:31 -0400
From: Robert Howe <arehow@vgernet.net>
Subject: [Fwd: Bass oboe FS]
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comRobert Howe wrote:
> Can you say more about this bass oboe: serial number, history, etc? And
> I think you are overpriced with a $5000 first bid, you are scaring away
> bidders. New Lorees are about $7200, I bought a wonderful 1980s
> specimen (Loree HW18) for $5600 from a dealer, and Nora Post had a
> Rigoutat in fabulous shape a few years back for $4500.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Robert Howe
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 21:48:13 -0400
From: Robert Howe <arehow@vgernet.net>
Subject: Re: eBay Experience
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comGrant's Ebay experience curled my hair. I too avoid Ebay on the basis
of some bad deals, but nothing *that* flagrant has happened to me.In one deal, an oboe advertized as boxwood (= older) was rosewood, the
dealer had colored the photo and made a "mistake". This oboe was also
missing a keytouch, which was artfully hidden in the photo.In another, an oboe was missing a thumbrest. Not a big deal, but the
seller--a music store--should have known better and mentioned this.In the final, an antiques dealers sold two Saxophones as is. Turned out
to be one Saxophone, and the keys to it.In neither case was my money refunded as requested. Negative feedback
is only so powerful.Robert Howe
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 21:44:45 -0400
From: jim and joyce <lande@erols.com>
Subject: eBay
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>>... Also, even though he "won" most of his own auctions, he never
>>bothered to give his other accounts positive feedback: between the three
>>accounts, and dozens of auctions, he had a net feedback rating of about +3.After lots of eBay purchases (old tools, toys and many metal clarinets)
I have yet to deal with a crook. Well, some people fail to disclose
obvious defects, but in all but one case I have been convinced this was
out of ignorance. However, I know that I have been lucky, because
there are several bad actors out there. Some simply are too greedy, so
you know something is wrong. I followed one auction and was amazed that
some guy bid a too laudably described Bundy up to $700. When I
searched, I discovered that he had also bid up a student Conn sax listed
by the same seller. I learned that the bidder was, in fact, working for
eBay. Once they documented the shilling, the seller disappeared. Most
sellers do not take credit cards, but I suppose that there is some
safety in that payment route.---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 23:35:58 +0100
From: Jim Katz <JimKatz@JohnAbbott.qc.ca>
Subject: Re: Star Wars Didgeridoo?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>I read the post about Star Wars low notes just before seeing the movie too,
>so I was listening. The low notes being played by the Gungan warrior were
>almost definitely being played by a didgeridoo (which is often mistaken for a
>"synthesized" sound but it's real, baby!)Anybody got the authoritative word on this? It's true that a didge could
possibly sound like this, but I'm not totally convinced.
Anyhow, I have some didgeridoos that are synthesized - by trees, ants, and
aboriginals - in that order....=85:} .--------------------------------------------------------
From: Heliconman@aol.com
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:42:19 EDT
Subject: Helicons with removable bells?!
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comIn a message dated 6/14/99 6:49:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
John.Howell@vt.edu writes:> A helicon (at least the ones I've seen and/or played) does not have a
> removable bell.The several helicons I've seen do not have a removable bell. I would think
that it would cut down the amount of resonance thus cutting down what some
consider a better sound than a sousaphone. There are times that I wish that
mine DID have a removable bell! Bus drivers LOVE to see me at the bus stop!
I've been brainstorming over how to build a gig bag that offers sufficient
protection while remaining fairly lightweight and easy to carry a little
ways. Maybe a sort of fiberglass suit of armor that would allow it to be
carried on your shoulder.
Cheers!
Heliconman@aol.com
---------------------------------------------------------From: Heliconman@aol.com
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 04:51:27 EDT
Subject: Re: Bass Saxes in Community Bands!?<g>
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comIn a message dated 6/14/99 7:04:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
gdgreen@contrabass.com writes:> >While somebody mentioned that, I have a question. Why, on contrabass
> >clarinet, do my eyes jiggle violently around 123 C#/C/B, but on notes below
> >that, they stagnate? It seems like it should shake more AN OCTAVE LOWER! It
> >does not.If I'm playing tuba or baritone while looking at the computer screen, I get
waves or a jiggling effect at certain frequencies, but I just chalk that up
to "beat frequencies". What's that called? Interharmonic aliasing or
something? I figure my head is vibrating at a Bb or whatever pitch and the
refresh rate of the monitor is probably a multiple of 60Hz, based on U.S.
standard house current, so both frequencies are close to Bb but not exactly
on the money, so as to create beat frequency waves. Sort of a variation on
the Conn Strobotuner.
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 07:11:50 -0400
From: Robert Howe <arehow@vgernet.net>
Subject: [Fwd: Re: Bass oboe FS]
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comThe seller of the Loree Bass Oboe FS responded to my note thusly:
Moorewatch@aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi Robert-
> My oboe wads purchased new in 1992-I have the original paper on it. It has
> never been used! In fact I purchased 2 reeds just to try it out[having been
> an old reed player some 50+years ago. I bought it from an estate sale in
> march of this year
>
> >From the intrest that I've had in this first day, I'm inclined to think that
> my reserve is close to the mark. The present retail on this instrument is
> $8000 according to a prominent dealer in reed instruments ,who handles the
> Loree line at present. The insrument has the barrel and key ext. along with
> all of the orriginal extras.
>
> Pictures are available by bringing up WWW.BandK.Com/Bob This will give you
> an index of pictures. Try Bob#3 first.
>
> Thank you for your
> inquiry,
>
> RJM
---------------------------------------------------------From: Pabstton@aol.com
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 09:52:20 EDT
Subject: Re: Star Wars Didgeridoo?
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comI have not seen the film yet. I live in Germany. It won't be released here
until September. But I noticed that nobody mentioned the possibility of a
plain ol' digital sampler or wavetable synth that utilizes samples. They can
be be sometimes very convincingly live-sounding, as samplers are used to
record and playback, in many cases, live sound. But the samples in synths are
then usually "enhanced" with a synthisised backround tone which would account
for the artificial sound. I could also guess that many soundtrack composers
would like to deny the integration of electronics into their repetoir, some
not, but who really knows what happens during post production also?Something else- Once I was experimenting with so-called "extended" sound on a
contraclarinet in our studio (ie. voicing, biting the reed, sqeaking, etc).
>From outside, my buddies thought I was playing a didgeridoo. They were
surprised to see it was just my clarinet. However, I don't think anyone
playing for John Williams would even think of biting the reed. So it's likely
not this.Something completely else- I have a recording from Willem Breuker (I think)
in which during a bass clarinet solo he plays one fundamental note while
playing a nice melody with the harmonics. Relevance- It had somewhat this
same wicked didgeridoo sound. This "extended" wind instrument stuff is
actually not that uncommon in jazz (even early jazz) and modern stuff.This is all probably not much news to many, but I hope this was at least a
little interesting.DPaten
---------------------------------------------------------
From: Robert Groover <groover@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: eBay Experience
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 07:41:40 -0700 (PDT)
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com> Grant's Ebay experience curled my hair. I too avoid Ebay on the basis
> of some bad deals, but nothing *that* flagrant has happened to me.
...Cmon guys, TELL the ebay managers!
My sense is that they're worried about fraud, and are likely to be
agressive about at least locking such scamsters out of ebay.Robert Groover groover@netcom.com (PGP key on request)
Member ECS, AVS, ACM, OSA, Sen.Mem.IEEE, Reg'd Patent Atty
"All men by nature desire knowledge."---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 09:37:29 +0000
From: Bob Thomas <thomas@usit.net>
Subject: Willem Breuker (was Star Wars Didgeridoo?)
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.comDPaten wrote:
>...Something completely else- I have a recording from Willem Breuker
>(I think) in which during a bass clarinet solo he plays one fundamental
>note while playing a nice melody with the harmonics. Relevance- It had
>somewhat this same wicked didgeridoo sound. This "extended" wind
>instrument stuff is actually not that uncommon in jazz (even early jazz)
>and modern stuff.Can you give us the recording info?
b.
---------------------------------------------------------Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:29:42 -0700
From: Grant Green <gdgreen@contrabass.com>
Subject: Re: eBay Experience
Reply-To: contrabass@contrabass.com>Cmon guys, TELL the ebay managers!
>My sense is that they're worried about fraud, and are likely to be
>agressive about at least locking such scamsters out of ebay.We did: that's why his account was canceled.
Grant
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Grant Green gdgreen@contrabass.com
http://www.contrabass.com
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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